+- MetalworkingFun Forum (http://www.metalworkingfun.com)
+-- Forum: Machining (http://www.metalworkingfun.com/forum-5.html)
+--- Forum: Horology (http://www.metalworkingfun.com/forum-40.html)
+--- Thread: Greg's Clock (/thread-2928.html)
Pages:
1
2
Greg's Clock - Mayhem - 11-06-2015
We may have to make a Horology section now...
RE: Greetings from San Diego - docclock - 11-06-2015
I think that would be an excellent idea!!
RE: Greetings from San Diego - f350ca - 11-06-2015
Doc
Sorry for the slow rely.
Will have to tear it out of the case to see if there is a manufacturer on it. After thirty years I sure don't remember. It has the three different chimes, cable driven with three weights as you said. I built the case from scratch loosely using a set of plans to get the case size correct to fit the movement and pendulum swing. It stands about 7 feet tall so guess it falls into the grandfather category. Used the same movement with a smaller pendulum to build a grandmother clock for the inlaws probably 20 or so years ago. Murray Clock Craft out of Toronto sold the movements back then, they still do but the price hasn't changed much so I expect these are now of an oriental flavour.
Had optimistically hoped an oiling would suffice. You may have bitten off more than you wanted offering to guide me through a rebuild if thats what it needs. Would like to get it chiming again, funny I never notice it when it was running but the silence now is defening.
May be a while till I can get at it but its on the list.
Thanks again,
Greg
RE: Greetings from San Diego - docclock - 11-06-2015
Hi Greg, Dont worry about your slow reply, I have plenty of time (chuckle). Depending on the case design you may be able to I.D. the movement without pulling it out. Cases that were built with consideration for the future service needs simply have a rear upper panel that can be removed after pulling a few screws. If you can see the back plate of the mechanism we can I.D. it. It being a cable drive from that era increases the chances of it being a Keineger. That would be very very good. The Cadillac of German movements in the last 50 years. Their trap plates are significantly thicker then the ones built by the other German manufacturers. This means there is a chance an overhaul need not be required at this time. When you get a chance, try to look at the back plate of the movement. Stamped on it will be a set of numbers or an alpha-numeric set. Let me know what you find. Also when you receive the oil you ordered please do not apply any of it till i can tell you where it must go. There are very specific oil points and also a bunch of places that must never be oiled even though it might look like it should be. Oil applied to the wrong place and also over oiling (a common beginners mistake) will cause a clock to run for just a few minutes then stop. This going to be a fun project for the both of us. It has always bothered me to see a pure mechanical timepiece that is not in operation so we will correct that problem. I'm available whenever your ready.
Lew
RE: Greetings from San Diego - f350ca - 11-06-2015
Doc
Curiosity got me going, I guess I was intending future maintenance and put a removable panel on the back.
Unfortunately its not a Keineger as you suggested but a Urgos model UW03051B there is another number (possibly serial no) 436819.
Interestingly a quick search shows NOS available. Why would anyone replace something we could spend weeks rebuilding?
Thinking back the poor thing had stopped a couple of times over the last couple of years but a gentle restart got it going. Why would I do maintenance on something that would restart? (Slap upside the head) This time no ticky though. When I oscillate the pendulum or with it removed now the lever (forgive my ignorance of terms) that connects to the pawls that engage the escape wheel there is no familiar click, or in watch maker terms tick / tock, but the wheel does index.
The oil arrived the other day, Pegasus is the brand, also received a vial of watch oil I hoped would work on my neglected dial indicators and micrometer threads.
Your inspiring me, I may try and steal the time to remove the movement.
Thanks ever so much
Greg
RE: Greetings from San Diego - docclock - 11-07-2015
A removable pane! I like you more and more. An Urgos 030 (sigh) still a pretty good unit. Are you sure you haven't done this before? Talking escape wheel and stuff. lol. The pawls we call pallets and the whole assembly that holds the pallets and has the piece that runs outboard of the mechanism then down and terminates with eiither a right angled slot or a pin or a 'T" is called the verge. Being an urgos we must now determine if your escapement (escape wheel, pallets, verge) is of the type autobeat or non-autobeat. Your gonna have to pull the movement to oil it. It's impossible to reach every oil point unless the movement is in hand with the dial removed. Step one will be to remove the weights then the pendulum. Then depending on how you configured the case you hopefully will be able to remove the usually 4 screws that hold the seatboard with the movement attached to it from the rest of the case. Again depending on configuration you should be able to remove movement still attached to seatboard and the dial attached to movement as one unit. This would be the ideal way and is a big plus for later on. Use caution when handling to not grab, pull on or twist the leader(the piece of flat stock that the pendulum hangs from) as the suspension spring that the leader hangs from is fragile. When its out snap a pic of the suspension spring. That way we will know if your unit is autobeat or not. Oops. forgot. Way easier to pull the movement if you remove the chime rods assembly first. To be continued......
RE: Greetings from San Diego - f350ca - 11-07-2015
Doc
Im pretty sure the panel wasn't forethought but the only way to instal the movement.
Have always been interested in clocks, actually bought my milling machine with the idea of building a LARGE movement to fit the house we had in Alberta, had dreams of 3 foot gears and if memory serves a 6 meter pendulum to get something like a 5 second swing. We moved and the thought never got past the dreaming stage.
Have a turn of the century mantel clock that belonged to my great aunt. I remember it getting oiled regularly with 3 in 1 oil. Im sure your cringing at this point. Decades ago I thought I'd get it going. Removed the movement and stared at the crusty mess. I was struck with an epiphany, carburetor cleaner shouldn't hurt this, and into a gallon of Gunk brand nasty smelling solution it went. After a bit of soaking I thought I better have a look. The gleam on the trap plates (we're learning) was blinding, but the gelatinous mess around the gear train was gut wrenching. We were at the sink or swim point, out came the screw driver and within minutes I had a tray full of bits and pieces. There was an old german jeweller/watch repairer in town. He helped me out. Supplied proper oil and suggested opening up the driving springs, wiping them down and lubricating them with a thin white grease. Miraculously it went back together and actually worked, haven't wound it in years but I suspect I could get it going again.
Anyway, back to today, here's a photo of the suspension spring (still in the clock) leader removed.
![[Image: IMG_1952.jpg]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-W_sRLojQNEA/Vj2Ql5ZDAXI/AAAAAAAADco/1N1wngR1kxA/s1280-Ic42/IMG_1952.jpg)
Your correct on removing the chime rods, think they have to come out to make room for the movement. Will look at it closer in the daylight but think the face might have to stay mounted and the movement pulled after the hands are removed.
Not clear what a seatboard is, I may have negated that and mounted the movement with 2 studs and nuts to a fixed horizontal bulk head that the moment sits on.
Thanks and good night.
Greg
RE: Greetings from San Diego - docclock - 11-07-2015
Well its an auto beat for sure. The autobeat is a great invention however nearly all of the end owners of these movements were never instructed as to how this particular movement should be started. if you have been starting it by simply giving the pendulum a push as is correct in any common non autobeat clock the auto feature can not do what its supposed to causing it to run in a condition known as out of beat. That translates to it requiring it to need more power to run. As it ages and wear sets in power through the train decreases and causes it stop. The seatboard in a common configuration is a horizontal board that would sit on two short riser blocks ar each end on top of your bulkhead. The movement on top and the plate that has the slots to hold the cable ends screwed to the bottom of it or if your movement has the retainer plates for the cable ends between the plates at the bottom of the movement the seatboard would just have cutouts for the cables to pass thru. urgos used both methods. Before i forget to tell you, Inspect the cable pulleys. Urgos are famous for wear to the hub thru which the axle passes causing the wheel to lean over and rub against the inside of the pulley frame eventually causing power loss stopping the clock. Have some errands to do tomorrow. Will check with you in the evening. Goodnight.
RE: Greetings from San Diego - docclock - 11-07-2015
Hey Greg, I am thinking this being the introduction section of the forum and we are about to go technical and others might benefit from it shouldn't we continue this project under a more appropriate section?
Lew
RE: Greg's Clock - docclock - 11-07-2015
Shazam!!!! An hour later and here we are in a new horological section.
The horological gods must be smiling upon us.